This is part two of this year's irreverent 'Watches & Wonders' coverage, if you missed part one you can read it by clicking the link below:
WATCHES & WONDERS PART 2: Rolex and Tudor
ROB: So Jim, I guess we might as well start with the most shocking release of the whole show... the left handed GMT Master II in green and black. What on Earth did you make of that?
JIM: Hahaha well I am pretty sure Rolex is trolling the market, no? I get a headache just looking at the damn thing, it looks like the girl you ended up with at 3am after your best friend got it on with the hot one you actually wanted. Do you like it? You can buy it for a 300% premium via Watchfinder and wear it on your right wrist. TAG Heuer on the left, retarded Rolex on the right. A truly genius combination.
ROB: I think... I think they saw the Pelagos LHD was well received and took that as a green light, but it seems to me they made one HUGE mistake. I think the problem with the GMT II is that it honestly looks like the watch is upside down, but the Pelagos doesn't because the date stayed on the right hand side of the watch. I think it would have been a lot better received if they had done that, because it literally looks like all they've done here is turned the dial upside down in the case and put the bracelet on backwards.
Having said that, for all the haters on the internet right now slagging this off, you know as well as I do this is going to be absolutely unobtainable. And actually it's pretty smart of Rolex to do this with a colour that's never been available before, it would have been a lot tougher sell if there was a traditional option already out there (like a Pepsi or Batman for example).
So yeah, I don't really think Rolex have anything to worry about, history has proven time and time again that people love quirky Rolex because they know those are the ones that become legends, and if this only lasts a year or two then it will become even more sought after by kooks who only care about rarity and investment potential.
But do I like it? Well, that's a tough one. I like the colours, but I can't quite get my head around the crown and the date being on the left, I would love to see a photoshop where the date was still on the right though, I think that would look way better.
JIM: Oh I agree, no doubt this will be impossible to get and many speculators will buy it just for the sake of the rarity. Most buyers hoping it will be a short run and like you said discontinued within two years. Anything to maintain what Rolex collecting is all about... profits and increased values!
ROB: So what about the yellow gold Yachtmaster? Apparently it is 42mm which is 2mm bigger than the rose gold one that came out a few years ago. I remember being very disappointed when I saw that IRL because I thought in the pictures that looked amazing but it was too small... but I'm not sure how I feel about yellow gold versus rose on that watch, I mean I prefer the rose for sure, but I'd want the rose in 42mm.
JIM: I had to look not one but a couple of times extra to understand that this was actually a new watch. I guess this proves how little I know about Rolex. But! With that said, I must say that this watch in yellow gold is quite the looker. I always prefer yellow gold over rose gold though, yellow gold is much more attractive. Interesting that they increased the size to 42mm. I could definitely see myself rocking this baller gold watch, summer day outdoors sipping on a glass of a fancy drink that your typical billionaire would enjoy. Who am I kidding, I would be drinking cold beer, but I sort of think this Yachmaster would look good with beer too.
So, I am guessing that given the precious metal, this piece is quite expensive? Does that mean it would actually be possible to buy after waiting for a while? Or are all Rolex watches banned from sale to normal customers these days, no matter the material and price point?
ROB: I'm guessing this won't be available anytime soon, no... but probably more available than a steel Submariner. I dunno, I like the rose cos I think rose goes well with black, but rose is a funny colour, it can look really pink but sometimes it's less obvious and quite hard to tell apart from yellow (I'm thinking back to when I've seen rose and yellow gold Aquaracers next to each other in Bicester Village).
While we are on the subject of precious metals, Rolex also debuted a new Day/Date in platinum with a crinkly bezel. I mean, okay.... I don't really get why you'd want an almost 'entry level' model that costs like £50,000+, especially in a metal that looks almost exactly like steel. I guess there's a perverse pleasure in wearing a really expensive watch that looks like it costs 20% of what it actually costs but I don't really get it.
Okay, so Rolex fanboys know a light blue dial means platinum, but most people won't. And the crinkly bezel is apparently a big deal because it's so hard to make in platinum, but then apparently the fan boys prefer the smooth bezel because it's a tell tale sign of a platinum Day/Date. You know, if the blue dial didn't already give it away.
Jesus, Rolex is so exhausting isn't it? Can you imagine getting a Calibre 5 Aquaracer in platinum, cos that's kinda like what this is...
JIM: Honestly I couldn't give a fuck, Rolex bores the tits off me.
ROB: Hahaa, okay... seems like everyone is turning against Rolex now. All the YouTubers are rebelling against them... it's like they all got together and decided to wield their immense power... 'I'm so done with Rolex!' they say. But they aren't because merely putting Rolex in the title of their video means it gets more hits. Like YouTubers who never talk about TAG Heuer, but they can't resist talking about them because it generates hater-hits.
JIM: It will only lead to higher prices. Honestly I know so little about Rolex, the only thing I think I know is that no model is available to buy. But I am not sure this is actually true. One Rolex I would like to own someday is the blue two-tone sub. Is this also 10 year impossible?
ROB: I'm afraid it probably is... so anyway, let's talk about Tudor. Seems like all the YouTubers have collectively decided to make Tudor the new Rolex, which is convenient since they are basically re-issuing the Rolex back catalogue.
JIM: Oh this is an interesting thought. Do you think eventually Tudor will be as obscurely difficult to buy as Rolex?
ROB: I think we are a long way from that. For sure individual models will have wait lists, but they have so many watches that no one really gives a crap about. So no, I just don't think they have the desirability through the range to get anywhere close to the hype the Rolex have generated for themselves.
JIM: No I don't think so either. Particularly, Tudor are light years away from having the same brand recognition as Rolex. I mean, basically every person in the whole world knows what Rolex is, right?
Ok so lets talk about the Tudor releases from W&W. Can you guess my favourite release?
ROB: Well for sure it will be the root beer GMT!
JIM: You are so wrong sir! My favourite is actually something I discovered after the actual fair. Something that did not get much attention but I think is something major. Tudor has for the first time ever put their Kennisi movement in the Black Bay 36! And not only that, they put it in a two-tone case, with a jubilee looking bracelet and finally the yellow gold has gone from brushed to polished. I was also extra impressed that the clasp now has a on the fly micro adjust, something my Black Bay 58 is lacking, and they introduced some truly stunning dial options. My favourite is this gold coloured dial with a star looking pattern. Can also be had with diamonds on the dial and on the bezel for those of us who want that extra bling!
I know that the talk about Tudor being good value for money is starting to sound like a broken record but it must be said about this model. You get so much fabulous bling for not too much money!
JIM: Spectacularly offensive in it's ultimate tackiness, just like my personality! Agree that most Tudors look kind of old fashioned but I like the idea of getting a two-tone watch that I will look as good with today as in say 30 years. But I totally get what you mean about 'not feeling it', that shit cant be forced.
Do you have a favourite from the Tudor releases?
ROB: Umm, well... see I just can't get excited about Tudor. It's like, okay... look I get it. They are well made and everyone on the THF forum is mad keen on them, but everything they make looks... kinda 'old-fashioned'. And I get that it's supposed to be 'vintage inspired' (or 'timeless' if you prefer) but honestly that does nothing for me. So I find it really hard to be enthused by the brand. Even though I get that they are probably better made, with better movements than TAG Heuer... if it doesn't give you that feeling then it really doesn't matter. But if I was pushed I would say probably the Black Bay GMT Professional, because in some pictures it looks kinda interesting, and by interesting I mean it looks a bit like the North Flag (via the Rolex Explorer, obviously). I just like yellow and black I guess. Hahaha.
JIM: I kind of like the Black Bay Pro too, it seems to be the hottest model according to most online watch gurus, some already crowning it the best watch release of 2022, even though we are only just in early April. Allow me to describe how I roll my eyes!
But I totally get what you mean about 'not feeling it', that shit cant be forced.
ROB: So I thought, I better go check on the Tudor website if there's something really cool and obscure I could talk about but instead I watched this video... which is just terrible. I mean, words fail me. Which marketing 'genius' came up with this drivel?
JIM: Haha yes I looked at this video too and boy that is terrible. Thinking about it, Tudor has never been a very marketable brand and their marketing strategy smells of 70 year old decision makers from Switzerland. At the same time, maybe this is one aspect I like with Tudor. I am not attracted to any exaggerated marketing about a watch being on the moon, a tool watch worn on a mountain or chronographs worn by F1 drivers. For me, with Tudor it is all about the product. How it looks, the quality and how it makes me feel. No marketing nonsense telling me what to think or feel about a certain model or the brand.
ROB: Yes, that is a good point. There is so much marketing bullshit in the watch world, I mean I just find it quite remarkable that grown men are so swayed by which watch (the fictional character) 'James Bond' wears on his wrist. At least NASA chose the Speedmaster on merit, (the fictional character) 'James Bond' would wear a MVMT if they chucked enough money in the ring.
JIM: But then sometimes I stumble upon some jackass on a podcast or YouTube video, saying that Tudor customers would rather wear Rolex if they could afford it. Then I ask myself if I think this is true for me, and I honestly don't think it is. If I had Rolex levels of money to spend on watches, I would probably not buy Tudor, but I would most certainly buy other brands (like IWC, JLC and Hublot).
ROB: Funny you mention JLC, I saw some insanely cool watches of theirs today in a Watchfinder video, and even the 'cheaper' Polaris they showed looked pretty cool... but yeah, no I wouldn't buy Rolex either, because for the cost of a Submariner I could get a carbon Carrera or a re-owned tourbillon!
JIM: Rumour has it that you, the legendary Robert, has the manliest watch wearing wrists in all of UK. I bet that new two-tone Black Bay chrono with gold dial would wear like a dream for you. What do you think of this new mesmerising dial colour?
And yes, marketing is not one of Tudor's strong points for sure! That video is cringeworthy, and really they choose some odd ambassadors, don't you think? David Beckham... really. Lady Gaga is kind of cool I suppose, actually Tudor seem to focus a lot of attention on the ladies market, my wife is always showing me Tudor adverts in Cosmopolitan or whatever magazine it is she reads. Maybe that's a smart move trying to sell to women who might not already have the same prejudices as guys in the watch arena?
Speaking of my wife, she wanted to buy the Tudor Clair de Rose a few years ago, but we couldn't find one anywhere... only in the larger size and she wanted the smaller size. But then I recall the movement was obviously not the right size for the dial as the date was like in the middle of the dial. It was the older model with the rose 'second hand'....
ROB: So I guess we should also take a look at the GMT Master II Root Beer... I mean the Tudor S&G Root Beer. I really thought that would be your favourite, but I guess it just wasn't tacky enough for you?
JIM: About the Root Beer... I was first going to say no, the problem for me is that there is not enough gold on it. But I realise that you might be correct, it ain't tacky enough for me. I mean I do like the look of it but not enough to get an urge to run out and try it on. Maybe it would be better with a root beer coloured pattern of gem stones on the bezel?
ROB: If only Tudor had a Bamford department....
JIM: So Mr 'I don't like classically designed watches'. Do you think Tudor would be even more successful if they adopted a more modern or futuristic design language throughout their lineup? When we talked about TAG's releases during W&W we concluded that TAG is choosing a modern design path, rather than relying on vintage design cues. We even covered whether the trend of vintage looking watches might slowly now start to die. Where does that put a brand like Tudor in the next 10 years?
ROB: The thing with Tudor is that right or wrong, they know what they are... or have found their niche, which is not with aggressively modern designs. It's not like they haven't made them, they just don't sell. How many people do you know with a Fastrider or a North Flag? Quite the contrary, Tudor are all about the Black Bay and really not much else.
What they have done there, and perhaps the reason it is so successful is that it can (not always, but it can) present as retro with the right dressing, but it's flexible enough to appear reasonably modern with the right colours, strap or model - much like the Submariner actually. It's an all things to all people kind of watch.
TAG Heuer's history is a strange one in the watch world, born of decisions made in the 1980s and 90s... where they completely cut ties with all their heritage models in favour of a line up of models that pretty much no longer exist (6000, Kirium, S/EL, 4000, Alter Ego), and that has put them out of step with the industry at large. But the recent reliance on re-issues over the last ten years or so has caused them headaches as they have felt the need to be both avant garde and retro at the same time. And that's before you even factor in the name change and the desire of retro fans for 'Heuer' branded dials, something that no other brand has to worry about...
It seems like Frederic is finally taking steps to establish TAG Heuer with a strong 'modernist' identity, which doesn't mean there can't be occasional Heuer branded re-issues, but they should be special pieces (perhaps in small numbers of say 500), which is basically where TAG Heuer was in the late 90s and early 00s.
JIM: The Pelagos seems quite popular though and that one is modern in spec and design.
ROB: Is the Pelagos really that modern though... or is it just more modern than a Black Bay? To me the Pelagos looks like it's loosely based on the Submariner, only bigger and with a lumed bezel. If you put it next to an Aquaracer it looks ancient. Plus, I'm betting you could find some old Tudor from the sixties or seventies that inspired it.
JIM: Tudor know what they are you say. This is a very good point. Something TAG has not appeared very sure of for quite some time now. Until recently, and I think you are correct with the modernist identity and I believe it is the right path for them.
Have to say it feels good to be on the topic of TAG!
ROB: Yup! Everything else is a bit of a chore.
JIM: Maybe we could just round off this Tudor discussion by concluding that you are wrong then? Tudor is a killer brand, the Pelagos has a nice modern design and the more bling there is, the better.
ROB: YES! I mean, wuuuut....
PART THREE WILL BE UP ON SUNDAY NIGHT/ MONDAY MORNING...
No comments:
Post a Comment